What is your religion?

What religion to you follow? Tell a bit about how you practice and what it means to you.






I am a Thelemite. I believe that Aleister Crowley is the prophet of the new aeon. And the faith itself was very well summed up by Crowley in The Comment of Liber AL; "There is no law beyond Do what thou wilt."

Many a wiccan and faux satanist have taken this to mean "do what you want," which is quite incorrect. The Will dear Crowley speaks of is the Will of the universe. Our belief on the origin of the universe is akin to the belief within the Hindu tradition, which is that we are not creations of God, but actualizations thereof. Part of this is that we are actualizations of little bits of personality. This is grossly oversimplified, but someone who is truly an artist at heart is someone who is the actualization of a part of The One's artistic side. Because we are all parts of The One we believe that if every person followed his or her will, there would be harmony and peace. Turmoil and suffering occur only when one tries to assert his or her idea of what they should be and do.


So does this mean I'm stuck with some random will?
It's not random, you're perfectly suited to it. That's like a fish asking, "Am I stuck having gills!?" No, you evolved into them because they were perfect for you. And in reality it's not so much you having that will as that will having you as an incarnation. When trying to understand this concept that's a vital flaw that many people make; thinking from the self out. It started with The One, who split into Wills, which were then incarnated (you).


If "Do what thou wilt" isn't "do what you want" why are you all hedonists!?
That's a different line (actually a few lines) from Liber AL, specifically from the book of Nuit.

51. ...Be goodly therefore: dress ye all in fine apparel; eat rich foods and drink sweet wines and wines that foam!

63. Sing the rapturous love-song unto me! Burn to me perfumes! Wear to me jewels! Drink to me, for I love you! I love you!


The One incarnates in order to experience. Get going and start experiencing! Besides, indulgence tends to help one find his True Will.


How is that going to help?
And yet another line from Nuit's section:
41. The word of Sin is Restriction.

There are only two things which should ever limit what you do; your Will and your desire. However, society has taught us all sorts of things which hinder this, such as modesty over nudity. Using that as an example, indulging in nudist tendencies or desires (assuming you have them) will help rid you of modesty, an unnecessary restriction. This way if it is ever part of your Will or desires to run around naked, you can do so free of shame and truly enjoy it.


And you think this care-free way of thinking is at all mature?
Quite, for it isn't all that care-free. With freedom comes responsibility. No longer abstaining from drugs one must understand health implications, dosage, and requirements that one will have. No longer hiding the body due to shame of nudity one must reevaluate his or her beliefs on the human form and come to terms with how he really feels with his body and the body of others, no longer able to simply lean on the crutch of "this is wrong. Period." And not only for my well being, but for the well being of those around me. I do not believe in a mystical law handed down by God which tells me not to kill. Therefore, I am free to kill and I need to be ready to do so if it is ever needed and I need to be able to recognize this time. I must also be ready for the emotional and mental result.

There is no devil who is tempting me, no inherent sin to corrupt and no evil simply implanted in all people. If I do something wrong, I did it. And what's more, there are no cleansing rituals, no mantras to get rid of bad karma, and no savior. If I do something wrong, there's nothing mystical to whisk that away. I am responsible now.

not sure i agree with all of that, but there are a few good points in that. as for me, i'm a christian, but not in the covert or die kind of way. i think that a lot of the interpretations of what the bible says are simplified so that people could wrap thier head around it. not saying it isn't true, the bible is true, but people can sometimes bend it. somtime accedentally, somtimes not. creation vs. evolution for example. i believe that god made everything with the ability to adapt to diverent eviorments on thier own. makes sense. especially with the, go forth and poulate the earth, thing. giving life the ability to adapt would be a wise move. i don't believe that everything was an accident that went from amino acids, to protiens, to bacteria, to animas and man over 4.6 billion years (i think the number is right). i believe he populated the earth and gave life the inherent ability to adapt to survive. this isn't perfect and i could right long detailed article covering every hole i can think of but now is not teh time. this is what i believe in a nutshell. on relifion in general (excluding, things like satanism, demon worshipping, ect.) i think that god gave each peoples what they could handel. like teahcing a science class. you don't give every deatial to middle school kids, just what they can comprehend. same thing. i think humanities task as we become smarter, wiser, more spiritual, ect. (in theary we should be doing this) is to discern the rituals, and practices that are uneccisary from the truth. like memorized prayers. they gave people what they needed spiritually but once you get past a certain point reciting becomes more redundant and a pain than spiritual, and more earnest heart-felt prayes can begin. and from talking to your self, you pray in a medative way making a true spiritual connection. if you have any questions or arguments, i will be happy to discuss them but please be civil.

I'm kind of curious as to two things.
1, which parts of my post did you not agree with?
2, why do you not include things like satanism in your over-all view?

i do and don't. spiritual beliefs that are evil, like satanism or a hypothetical religion that beats women and has human sacrifices for example, because they would be inspired by A- a very twisted and power hungry person B- making somthing they do't uderstand into a god (like a volvano and throwing people inot it to appease the fire god) or C- a evil spiritual being, like satan or a demon or some other being. i was speaking of the one God. make more sense.

as for you other question, i don't agree with us being separate incarnation of God, or the One. i don't make much of a fuss about names. or him wanting to expirience, drugs, sex, ect. not saying this applys to you but a lot of people would use that as an excuse to do whatever they wanted, like rape, killing, drugs, theft, ect. i do think that we are all connected and that we should follow what we are most interesed in (art, science, teaching, martial arts, ect.) but not just do whatever with no restriction.

i know i answered those in reverse order, sorry if it was confusing.

*sound of breaks screeching*
Hold on! There's a problem with this! What makes Satanism evil? Satanism promotes caring for oneself (which a surprising number of people don't do. They care about themselves but treat themselves like utter shit), it supports people having no more or less rights than they can handle, suggests that children, animals, and "weaker" people be protected (a far cry from the usual image of them hating everyone and sacrificing animals), and stupidity is a Satanic sin.

Why not?

Again, why not? Plainly put why the hell did He make us?

That's a problem with people, not the religion. People have used the Bibles as an excuse to murder thousands of people during things like the Inquisition, but that doesn't make the Bible bad.

Read again. Christianity supports that more than Thelema.

satanism, by it's name, worships satan. in my book Satan is as evil as it gets. i'm not saying that everything in it is bad, if it was it wouldn't get much of a following. i also don't know much about it, but anything worshipping satan i can't see as a good thing. it may promote a lot of very good things, but it probably has some other stuff too that go against the bible. if you don't follow the bible fine, but a lot of the stuff in it makes sense.

for this, simply put, God is perfect, no way he would incarnate into such imperfect things. and i mean extremely imperfect. look at the world, it's a mess and i can't believe incarnations of God would do that.

because i would sincerly hope that God would follow his own rules. drugs are a way to escape reality for a brief period of time, sex (with a man and woman who are truely in love) is a good thing, but God isn't human (little redundant i know) adn sex is a human thing. God is way above us as a being and it would likly have little appeal. he dousn't love any particular person on that way. true sex is gives a feeling of unity and oneness. God in omnipresent, essentially one with everything. all the time. as for the other part, if i knew that i would be writing a best seller rght now. i can only guess, but i think it was just to create somthing to love, whach grow, kind of like raising an animal or bonzai trees.

I'll give you this one, it is truely embarassing some of the thing people have done "in the name of God"

please explain the last one, don't quite get how. also keep in mind i am no expert.

to make a small comment did you know that Satanism was recently recognized by the US Army as an official religion and built a church under the military for satanist? I have met many people in the army who are recognized as pagans, witches, or satanists, not to many though.

but to ask something, would you claim Satan and Lucifer to be the same thing?

If God is perfect then it doesn't matter because he couldn't create such imperfect beings either.

As for the last one, in Christianity Jesus wipes away your sins. Meaning so long as you follow Jesus you get of Scott-free.

If I punch you I am completely and utterly responsible for that. I am responsible for how it effects you, I am responsible for how it effects me, I am responsible for the shift in karma, I am responsible for anything you do as a shift of paradigm caused by my actions, etc. While Christianity doesn't promote "just doing whatever with no restriction," Thelema makes it pretty clear that there are very real and dire consequences of behaving like an ass.

That the word of Sin is Restriction doesn't mean "you go ahead and rape people if you want," it means, "Let nothing but YOUR Will and YOUR choices guide you."

And as stated, YOUR choices carry consequences and there's no mystical savior to fix it if you decide to do something awful.

mejita, yes i consider satan and lucifer as the same being.

TC, yes Christ wipes away your sins, but the idea is that ou won't want to sin as much. becoming saved (truely saved not just saying your saved and being babtized) gives you a connection with God and as it grows you come more spiritual. also you are orgivin for your sins, butou don't get off scott free. biblical law still has consequences. so douse the world. i'm not saying there aren't consequences, just that sins are forgivable and our souls can be cleansed. repenting isn't just praying for forgivness and then going on business as usual. you grow spiritually and remove the sins from your life. eventaully they loose thier appeal.

The point is that in the early stages especially it's easy to fall into the idea of "well Jesus can fix it when I fuck up!" whereas Thelema has the opposite.

yes it is. but the bible teaches not to do that. too many christians don't read at all or not nearly enough. i myself should probably read it more. if you follow the bible and truely have a relationship with god you won't fall inot those ruts, and will have the wisdom to not be all midevil.

I figured you would of said that.

To go back to satanist and people who believe in satan/lucifer being evil and all. Did you know that Lucifer, formily known as Luciferan, the Seraphim angel of god's right hand, God's greatest and most prideful angel, that Lucifer means "the bringer of light and enlightenment". Light and Enlightenment? Yes thats right, it's in a book I've slowly been reading over a long period of time called "The Secret History of Lucifer" by-Lynn Picknett. There's alot of biblical research is in this about how Lucifer is not depicted as an evil being as the church pictured many many moons ago, but as an angel that defied it's creator to bring man to light and enlightenment. Now why would something called the bringer of light be such an evil deity?

now I'm no christian, catholic, etc. but I beleive there's some god that I do whats right in life that I would be judged as a good person on go to heaven, I don't believe I should throw myself blindly into the fate of a deity that I really don't know exists. I believe I can control my own fate, and I believe in karma, what comes around goes around. I don't believe I should follow any mortal being as a way to channel my spirituality, and I don't think that I will give myself to a god.

yes i did know that about lucifer. and it dousn't seem like a bad thing to want to enlighten people, but look at the world. we were gien knowledg of good and evil. guess wich is more appealling, and guess wich one people will natually go for. evil wins out over good most time talking about appeal and spur of the moment fun. also you aren't giving yourself up to God, i hate that about churches. they say to surrender your life to Him. I'm like you in that aspect, i want to run my own life. i think the main reason they say that is the "He will help you through your troubles" bit. He dousn't run your life, like i said earlier it is a spiritual connection that most people can't fully understand so it is simplified some. your spirituality is in your hands, the religion helps people to make the connection with God and grow spitritually becasue they wouldn't on their own.

I've always really frowned upon the whole idea of "well, just let God run every aspect of your life."

Well that's crap. Why not let God, say, influence every aspect of your life? I never quite understood how the best way to heaven was to be lobotomized.

Update of happy times:
I hunted down the local EGC chapter and I'll be attending mass this Sunday. 'Una seemed a tad shocked when I explained that it has a tendency to include the priest performing oral sex.

what is ECG?

When talking about satanists, what you think is irrelevant. Plainly but, Satanists do not infact all worship Satan, Satans or indeed even Lucifer (Or the many manfestations within. Thrasher: ur l34d34 pWns dem. Crowley>Gamagen)


Lucifer was sent down from heaven, similar to prometheus because he taught us the arts of War, Magick and Scholarship. In such a manner, Satanists often are merely trying to improve themselves, respect the arts and their opwn bodies, reaching their potential.

EGC, not ECG.

It's the Ecclesia Gnostica Catholica. Pretty much the church of Thelema.

And MAN was it intense. Afterwards I couldn't stop shivering. And for a while all I could say was, "what!?"

I was blown away on so many levels.

I suggest everyone give it a try!

-joke- I belong to the Church of Notgiveashitism

Its pretty much straight forward lol

that's one of the best i've heard in a while. i would encourage you to be more spiritual with your life, not neccesarily religous, though. but i must admitt, i see a lot of good in notgiveashitism.

Lol, im here, thats enough spiritualism for me, I dont care for gods, i believe people should place some trust in themselves rather than dieties