Restoration, what to change?

So, I have now pulled apart and will start rebuilding again.

One question which I would find interesting to discuss, is what would you change when your CJ3B is totally apart?

I am asking cause I am not a mechanic, but ok with the tools. So whilst I am here I might as well get most things schmicko...

So I am thinking:
- Full new gasket set for the engine (will be checking pistons and rings)
- New head gaskett and reseating of the valves (unleaded ones?)
- New shocks
- Springs either reset or replaced (would like to keep if possible)
- Brake shoes relined, brake drum done
- New clutch plate
- Reconditiong of all brake cylinders
- Reconditioning of gear and transmission (jumped out of 3rd)
- Reconditioning of carburattor and fuel pump
- LOTS of wiring to be replaced....
- A new alternator (she is allready 12V but I dont think it was charging)

Things I am not sure if need replacing are (for instance) body mounts, would you replace them? Any more things "whilsty I am there" kind a like?

I am asking because I want a reliable vehicle after restoration, and we are planning on doing a big 4wd trip so want to prepare her for ultimate reliability.

Any insight\opion would be appreciated!

I highly suggest all first time rebuilders to restore back to stock standard or stock optional condition.
As you will never be dissapointed with the outcome nor depreciate the Jeeps value.

See: http://z4.invisionfree.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_B...?showtopic=2157
Also See: "MODIFICATION PARAMETERS" (search)


Remember dirt is the mechanics # 1 enemy. So clean all components.
A thorough cleaning provides ample time to familiarize yourself with the parts.
Visually inspect each component of each assembly and repair every component that is not servicable.
Replace parts only when repaired components cannot be made servicable.

One cannot re-use piston rings if they are removed from the cylinder bore or rotated in the bore.
Exhaust valves are especially critical to a dependable engine build.
Even though valve grinding is considered standard practice
I always re-place the guides and only use new exhaust valves.
These blocks are notorious for cracking between # 2 and 3 exhaust valves.
The #2 to # 3 block cracking is directly related to poor exhaust valve seating.
It is acceptable to regrind intake valves with new guides installed.
The heavy connecting rods have tremendous inertia.
So have the rod journals sized.

I have never had spring leafs re-arched. It's far too easy to ruin the temper.

If you visually inspect every item you will "KNOW" its reliability.
Some components like bearing faces need to be inspected in full sunlight under magnification.
Again... inspect everything and when in doubt ask questions as you procede.

I agree with Oldtime, but would recommend a couple of upgrades for safety -
I believe strongly in swapping to the dual chambered master cylinder and would recommend considering upgrading to 11" brakes (but note that standard 15" wheels often won't fit).

Returning everything to original will work and the jeep will stop fine, but I prefer the thought of splitting the front from rear brakes - there must be some benefit in it as all vehicles today are built this way.

Good luck!

Scott

I agree with oldtime's advice except when it come to master/wheel cylinders. My experience rebuilding these is that they never last as well as a new cylinder and I always replace them. The few extra dollars is more than worth the time it takes to do them again. Re-arching springs doesn't work very well either and within a year or two, they will likely be back to where they are at now.

+1 on this

There are definite safety benefits to installing a dual master cylinder. In addition, unless you are committed to properly adjusting the brake shoes on a regular basis, I would also go with modern self adjusting brakes. If you are going to tear the jeep down, there is no reason not to do these things.

Of course, if you are going to build a show quality restoration, go 100% original. If you are going to actually drive it, make it safe.

I have driven thousands of miles without using any brakes in my attempt to fully comprehend "safety vs. ecomony".
The standard 9" brakes themselves are not inherently dangerous.
In fact they are the opposite. They are a time proven safety feature.
In proper working condition they are perfectly adequate and have been stopping Jeeps for many years.
Guys get into touble by not keeping the brakes properly serviced.
And yes, the parking / emergency brake is part of the standard braking system.
I see fools remove the parking brake all the time yet no one corrects them.
Even the largest of disk brakes can and do fail.

9" drums do not have the CAPACITY of larger drums nor does the standard 3B have the added safety of a split master supply.
For 1st time rebuilders it is imperative that they fully understand basics before attempting ANY upgrades.
One can always upgrade the brakes and the steering or whatever at a later date after knowledge is realized from actual hands on experience.
Rebuilding back to "stock standard" condition provides a solid foundation upon which mechanical knowledge may later increase.
Yes rebuilding certain components like the master cylinders, wheel cylinders and clutch driven disks are considered well beyond the beginners ability.

Eh, I don't know. Don't mean to have a () contest here, but this is a good point of discussion. Having basic mechanical knowledge and learning how to rebuild does not necessarily mean that you have to start your learning with 50+ year old technology as a base. Pro's and con's of upgrading brakes aside, if you are learning automotive braking for the first time, you can just was well learn dual master cylinder plumbing and modern self adjusting brakes just as easy as the single master cylinder and manual adjusting brakes. Plus, you have the added benefit of actually using that knowledge on 99+% of all other vehicles you may choose to work on for the rest of your life.

If you want to say that simply replacing existing parts in kind is easier, well, you're right about that, no question. But if you're even considering tearing a vehicle down to the frame, you're going to get past 'basic mechanicing' pretty quick. And, I would have loved to have the body off to do my dual master cylinder upgrade, but had to do it lying on my back. Not much fun.

I learned to drive in my old 3B in the hills if western KY, and I was taught by my father who drove it for the many years prior, "don't ever trust the brakes". I took many a ride down hills before I took to the learning and geared down and even went into low-low so I didn't have to rely on the brakes so much. The best thing I ever did for my peace of mind was upgrade the brakes. Now I have no fear when my kids drive it.

Just my $0.02, which isn't even worth a fraction of that today.

Thanks guys, question brings up some good discussion.

I think I will leave my brakes standard, firstly for simplicity,I allready have the parts available (and reconditioning parts ordered) so thats easy. Second, to the point of OldTime; "Guys get into touble by not keeping the brakes properly serviced" I am used to the old skool mechanics (own a 1953 Royal Enfield which I used for nearly 90.000 k's) and am used to regular (read sometimes daily) maintenance. I will look into replacing on the longer run though, good point.

Any other upgrades usefull?

I will be replacing the alternator with a bigger one, does this have any impact on the power of the engine? I mean if its a heavier duty one (lets say 50 amp) would that make the engine work harder to pull it along?

Last question is about the springs, I called a shop today and they said no worries the can reset them. It aint cheap tho, $400, gulp. Would it be cheaper to simply replace them? And if so, any recomendations of number of leaves etc.

I'd rather get them reset but it sounds like the tempering is going to be an issue?

Thanks and great stuff, I am learning a lot!

Wow, if they want $400 to re-arch springs, you might as well buy new. You won't need to spend much over $500 for new.

One warning. If you get rear springs rated to replace the original springs, you will get a very rough, jouncy ride. Original springs were rated for close to a half ton of load so when running empty, the rear will bounce like an empty dump truck.

If I had it to do over again, I'd get custom made springs with a much lower rating to soften the ride. I run empty virtually all the time so don't need 1,000 lb load capacity.

it's time vs money. lol

the orginal brake platform must have been ok, if not it would have been upgraded sooner vs later. it's a 2,200 pound machine. and as some have said it wyands ups slow and stops the same. you can go to 11" brakes... i've scene kits go in up wards of 1,100$ if you can get a set cheaper have at it. if you keep your brakes maintanced you should be good. do the work as you can, it wil help save cost. all theys new parts will cost ya some coin, so pick a area like brakes or engine and work on that group. i'd put off the bigger project till winter when ya have more time ??/ and it won't be down for the spring/summer shows and rides.. as of rthe alt. gen i'd keep going till ya know you need to upgrade. as for the springs you can get after markets for about the same price. this jeep is a money pit, you can spends lots on it, just make sure your enjoying it ! running or not..

Young or old the novice rebuilder has a tremondous amount of learning tp aquire.
The Jeep is highly complex because it must function as a single unit formed from a multitude of sychronous sub assemblies.
Younger mechanics are especially prone to over confidence in their abilities.
They tend only to observe individual parts or sub assemblies
and do not fully comprehend how assembly components need be sychronous to the unit.

The cleaning / inspection procedure allows for hands on comprehension of component detail.
Each individual will "KNOW" if and when they are truely ready to modify.
Till then "Stock Standard" is the KNOWN solid foundation, easily recognizable by way of its time proven duration.

The "CENTRAL STANDARD TIME PROVEN UNIVERSAL"
is the ultimate knowable credit toward automotive mechanical excellence.
Because absolutely nothing outruns the clock.