Canvas half cab identification?

I went to look at a Jeep tub the other day. Too rough so I passed. Then I said, "Have you got any other old Jeep stuff?". They said, "Well, we've got this old canvas top".

I've read the posts on 3B concerning canvas tops (very helpful!)

I think it is from the mid/late 1950's. There are no labels or other identification in it. I'd like to know the manufacturer, model, etc.

Top w/ doors



Rear section. I got the back panel but it hasn't made it home yet. I can post a pic of it later in the week.



Frame w/ stabilizer board.

Board is right! I've never seen a spacer that size before! I wonder if this was a specific model peculiarity or a modification from a PO at some point?

First off you need to verify what it fits.
In general the canvas fabric tops fit military or CJ prior to the mid 1960's.

The edge where the top attaches to the W/S appears to fit into a W/S channel.
The front channel mount feature excludes models MB, GPW, and CJ-2A.
The front channel mount feature indicates M38, CJ-3A, CJ-3B, M38-A1, CJ5 or CJ-6.

What is the width of the top where it mounts to the W/S ?
That will indicate either M38A1, CJ-5, CJ-6 vs. the flat fender models.

If it fits CJ-3's then the door to windshield shape will verify CJ3A vs. CJ-3B.
If it fits CJ-3's then measure thre straight edge portion where it enters the door channel.

If canvas is approimately 52" wide at front is for a CJ-3A or B.
If door channel insert has about 22 inches of straight edge its for CJ-3B.

Board is right! I've never seen a spacer that size before! I wonder if this was a specific model peculiarity or a modification from a PO at some point?

Rus,

Thanks for your reply. It is definitely stout. See my reply to oldtime below for explanation.

(I tried to respond to this post last evening but couldn't access it for some reason)

Oldtime,

Thanks for your reply. I should have been a bit more specific in my first post. I'm pretty sure it is a CJ-5 top. The frame matches Bart McNeil's description for a CJ-5 top, including the "stabilizer board" which replaced the steel bar of earlier tops and the straps intended to use for storing the doors overhead. And if you look at the "rear" picture, you can see the imprint of the stabilizer board on the fabric. So, it looks like this top was used with this frame.

Here's a link to his article on 3B. Scroll to the bottom for his description.

http://www.film.queensu.ca/cj3b/SoftTopHistory.html

I'm wondering about manufacturer, model name, etc.

McNeil refers to the "1956 Universal Jeep Service Manual". I'm guessing that is a factory manual, which says to me that this was sold through dealerships. I'm wondering if anyone has any references to it in sales literature?

Thanks,

Jack

Well the stabilizer board was also used on most other models besides the CJ-5.
In fact the pic shows a CJ-2A with the board.
So the use of the board itself merely indicates that this is not one of the very earliest tops.

To posatively identify the manufacturer of this top the best method is via comparison to know facts about the various Willys canvas tops.
In this way one can determine if it is a Willys top or some other manufacturer.
If its a Willys top it must meet the known details.

Before we procede to verify I must know the width of the top were it enters the windshield channel.

Thanks again for the good reply. Here's a (fuzzy) picture I took of the top with a tape measure in place. The distance is 54". Have I got the tape in the right place?

The 54" measurement seems to verify my suspicions about this top.
I now have 2 good reasons to support my suspicions concerning the tops fitment application.
I prefer 3 points of evidence whenever available.
Before I give my 2 reasons let me state that I already believe this is a genuine Willys top.
I state this because it fits known detail concerning the design characteristics of the Willys tops.

#1) Assuming it is a genuine Willys top it does not appear to be for model CJ-5 nor CJ-6.
I state that because the color appears to be too faded to have been black.
The Willys CJ-5, CJ6 top was only available in black. (code Y-31)
This top appears to be slate grey (code 15)
The CJ-3 tops were available in slate grey.

#2) The 54" measurement also seems to verify my suspicion about this tops fitment application.
The CJ-3B windshield is about 53" wide. (measurement in my head not actual)
The CJ-5 windshield is about 59-1/2" wide. (measurement in my head not actual)
This 54" measurement seems to indicate it fits a CJ-3A or CJ-3B.

To determine "A" or "B"; Please measure the straight edge portion of the door edge where it enters the windshield channel.
Also can someone please verify exact windshield widths and the width of channel on the various windshields ?

That detail will conclude the tops model application.

Now back to my determination about its Willys origin.

As I look at your pics I see it has 4 straps at the rear edge of the top.
2 of those straps will attach the top to the top of the wheelhouse.
The other 2 straps will attach the top to the side of the body tub.
When you get the rear panel it should also have more straps that will attach to the rear floor pan.

The Willys rear panel is attached to the top via 11 fasteners.
As I look at your top I count the correct number of 11 fasteners to attach the rear panel.
As already mentioned this top also uses the stabilizer board.
The Willys halftop bow assembly will have 3 parts, the 2 uprights plus a middle section.
Also the driver side door zipper helps to reveal its true Willys origin.

Ken,
Soft top bows of the 1950 3A Knorr Jeep.
http://www.film.queensu.ca/cj3b/Photos/Sib...TopInterior.JPG
I think this would rule out a 3A top
http://www.film.queensu.ca/cj3b/Siblings/Caprio3A.html

Lawrence

Thanks Lawrence, that got me to checking into this further.
I withdraw my previous surmise that the top in question is intended for a CJ3.

Initially I was concerned that the color did not appear to be black.
But looking at the windows one can surmize that this top has endured extreme sun exposure.
So quite possibly its just faded that awful much.

Secondly I went to measure my CJ-3B windshield.
The windshield channel measures 50-1/2 and the OAL width is 52-1/4".
So the 54" figure previously noted is possibly correct for a shrunken CJ-5 measurement.
Also I checked on the # 689154 Stabilizer board.
Apparently the stabizer board was only used on CJ-5, CJ-6 models.
Both CJ3A and CJ-3B use #670938 Bar spacer (front center top bow)

So now I'm thinking it is # 689340 front top kit for CJ-5.
Willys also calls it a half top.

I am very grateful to you both for the time you've spent helping me determine the origin and application of my top. It's good to hear that my original belief that this is a CJ-5 top appears to be confirmed.

I'm also glad to hear that it appears to be an original Willys top.

To me, this top is a relic. A rare item. Something to be treasured and protected. I doubt I ever put it on a vehicle, at least not one I intend to use regularly. I gave it a quick rinse after I got it, but I intend to give it a good wash with mild soap, rinse and dry it thoroughly and store it properly.

Jack

Nice find!

The board is actually mentioned in the CJ5 owners manual, it was supposed to give enough strength so you could store the soft doors above your head! I have not tried it with mine. And I believe the board is only correct for the early CJ5.

Thanks russnj, I'm feeling pretty lucky to have found it.

That was one of the first bits of info I found that led me to think it was a CJ5 top.

For those interested, here's the article I read. Scroll down to the "Canvas Top Installation Instructions" at the bottom of the page.

http://www.film.queensu.ca/cj3b/SoftTopHistory.html

Here's a picture of the back panel installed. It's missing a strap on the lower left corner.