right/best starter?

What's the original/stock part number for the starter for a 1954 3B, 12volt?

An Auto-Lite MCH-6207 is there, now.

The Bendix doesn't engage on the first turn of the switch but always engages on the second turn of the switch. (There's a three-or-four-second whir with no engagement with the flywheel in the first turn of the switch. Don't know if this means the starter's moving toward "toast."

Peter DeBella tells me that the MCH-6207 is the wrong starter for my jeep; Walcks tells me it's the right right starter.

Any guidance from someone who's not selling parts would be appreciated. Thanks,
Greg

P.S. tried the search function first, but, as usual, it's down.

http://z4.invisionfree.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_B...?showtopic=4135

doug, I tried what you suggested first, and this is what came up:

403. That’s an error.

Your client does not have permission to get URL /custom?domains=z4.invisionfree.com%2FCJ3B_Bulletin_Board&q=starter&sitesearch=z4.invisionfree.com%2FCJ3B_Bulletin_Board&sa=Search&client=pub-2404175891811072&forid=1&channel=7202546313&ie=ISO-8859-1&oe=ISO-8859-1&safe=active&cof=GALT%3A%23008000%3BGL%3A1%3BDIV%3A%23FFFFFF%3BVLC%3A663399%3BAH%3Acenter%3BBGC%3AFFFFFF%3BLBGC%3AFFFFFF%3BALC%3A0000FF%3BLC%3A0000FF%3BT%3A000000%3BGFNT%3A0000FF%3BGIMP%3A0000FF%3BLH%3A1%3BLW%3A1%3BL%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Finvisionfree.com%2Fa.gif%3BS%3Ahttp%3A%2F%2Finvisionfree.com%3BFORID%3A1%3B&hl=en from this server. (Client IP address: 50.46.147.131)

We apologize for your inconvenience, but this request could not be processed.

Please click here to continue your search on Google.

That’s all we know.

Greg,
What you got (and copied for us to see) is what you get when you click on Search at the top and type in what you are looking for. There's something wrong with the Search function.

The link Doug posted was the Pinned topic (first one on the main page of topics) covering how to search since the search function isn't working right.

In a nutshell, copy the bold part of the message (highlight and right click to copy) then in the google search window (not the URL address window) paste it, add a space and then type what you are looking for.

Then and only then will the search function work.


Back to your question about starters, I am a firm believer that if it fits, fix it. When you buy replacements you run the risk of it not lining up correctly. The bendix may be going bad. IF your starter came with the engine and it did work, you could take it to an electrical shop (usually listed under alternator/starter) and ask if its fixable - it may even be cheaper to fix vs. mail ordering a replacement. Ditto for the generator.

It seems very likely that this particular Autolite MCH-6207 starter was original to your 1954.
It is a 6 volt starter.
If you specifically want a 12 volt starter then try to locate an Autolite MDM-6005 or an MDU-7004.

Rus, good advice about the search; I'll follow it; and I agree with you regarding fixing rather than replacing.

What I don't understand, Oldtime, are the details about using a 12-volt battery with a 6-volt starter. This is the way the jeep came to me, and don't have the foggiest idea what I should do regarding what's "right, best, most correct" for a starter for this 1954 jeep as it came to me—with this starter and a 12-volt battery.

I don't know enough about anything related to auto mechanics to know if it's unwise to keep the six-volt starter and 12-volt battery as it is. All I'm trying to do is do what's most correct and reliable, given the jeep I've got.

I have no problem with taking it out and attempting to replace problematic parts; also, I have no problem with getting a more appropriate starter, if it's needed. Whatever's best for the vehicle is what I'm seeking to do and discover.

greg

p.s. I'll report on the good results I've had with the fuel pump ... in the appropriate posts.

I thought being able to do the brakes was a fluke, but thanks to the patience and detailed information I've gotten on the forum, I don't have to be victimized by lying automechanics who treat other people's vehicles like garbage that came free. That's an entirely new joy in my life. Thank you to those who have offered help.

Hey Greg,

It's pretty simple. A 6V starter will work perfectly well on a 12V system for years and years. As long as you don't sit on the starter and grind and grind to get the engine started, it will probably never burn out.

If you have your engine tuned up to where it'll start with just a bump or two of the starter, you'll never have to replace it (well, unless you drown it in a river crossing or something like that).

Many guys (myself included) have Jeeps that were converted to 12V decades ago and still have the original 6V starter in them.

Mind you, that's the ONLY component you can get away with keeping in a 12V conversion, unmodified. Well, you can keep the light bulbs, but they'll burn out pretty quick.

Some guys have kept the 6V horn and it's lasted years, but you need to just go beep, beep with it. A long honk can burn it out.

You can keep the dash gauges by adding a 12V to 6V regulator. I vaguely remember some threads about that in the past. That's a very common thing on the hot rod boards as well. Google is your friend. Of course remember the speedo, oil and temp gauges are not electric so not an issue. The ammeter works on current, not Voltage so that's not an issue. So it comes down to the gas gauge - the bete noire of many old Jeep restorers - myself included.

Greg,
I can actually address the 6V vs. 12V question. While it has been discussed often, I actually did this with my jeep. Originally, I got the jeep as a 6V vehicle. It had multiple electrical problems but due to not having access to this page or the invention of the internet, I had to rely on, "those mechanics," who while good intentioned, didn't really understand 6V systems or the CJ specifics. (I later learned I was missing a ground strap and the cables were way too small).

I converted to 12V. I got a 12V gen/reg, swapped all the bulbs out and tried to get the gas gauge to work by swapping in a "12V" gauge and float. It never really worked, so I used a stick to verify.

Back to the starter. I left the 6V in place. When it was a 6V system, the jeep would turn over real slow and made a, "Grunt, grunt, grunt" noise when starting - hence the jeep's name that also came with the purchase: Green Gruntt.

That all changed with the 12V swap. The 6V starter turns over real fast! Assuming the fuel and fire are adjusted correctly, you would expect a very rapid start. This will work just fine as long as you don't sit on the starter and continuously run it attempting to start a stubborn engine. Short bursts are okay. Understand the starter will wear out sooner than a 12V as you are running a higher voltage through it. I had this setup for 7 years before I parked the jeep to go overseas. It still has the same starter and I plan to hook it back up since it was working from before. When it does quit, I'll take it in - explain what I'm doing - and hopefully get it repaired.

Technically not correct, but its consider O.K. to use 12 volts on a 6 volt jeep starter.
12 volt application will cause the 6 volt starter to turn faster than a 6 volt battery can spin it.
This generally makes engine starting easier.
The main draw back to using 12 volts on a 6 volt starter is that the windings were not intended for 12 volts.
This means that a 6 volt starter under 12 volt surge will heat up faster than a comparable 12 volt starter.
Bottom line is that one should be aware of the 6 volt starter limitation.
Avoid continuous cranking !
If engine does not start well, then tune or repair it so that the 6 volt starter will never be allowed to overheat.
Othwerwise the correct 12 volt starters (Autolite MDM-6005 or an MDU-7004) should be considered.

I am currently re-building the ultimate Trans Vintage CJ-3B.
It is strictly a CJ-3B yet it entails the absolute best components taken from all vintages 1953 - 1965.
It's Hurricane engine will be equipped with the MDU-7004 starter.

Greg, I like the Toyota Land Cruiser gear reduction starter. They are readily available from any auto parts store and their price is very reasonable. They carry a lifetime warranty and are very easily installed. You should seriously consider these starters if you plan on using your 3B on a regular basis. The Toyota starters are more efficient and will spin the engine faster than a stock model. Here is a link to the info on this type of starter: http://z4.invisionfree.com/CJ3B_Bulletin_B...?showtopic=4048. I hope this helps, Sam Michael Jr, Jax, FL

Greg, for your starter question on your 54 CJ-3B, our 54 CJ-3B has been converted to 12V. I have the Pertronics electronics in the distributor, I have the hotter coil and wires on the F Head. I still have the original 6V starter. I only get a part of a rotation from the starter and the little 4-bangers is running.
It is true you do not want to continually crank the 6V starter with 12V's or it will go south in a hurry. But if your 4-banger is tuned right, the faster spinning 6V starter will start the 4-banger in a hurry. Our jeep has been this way now for about 6 or 7 yrs. It still starts with only a bump from the 6V starter. Freshening the 6V starter when you can also helps it last.
We would still like to see pictures of your 54 Highhood.
Dick W. Spokane Wa.