The Seal of God and the Mark of the Beast, Is the Sabbath really involved?

Seventh Day Adventists have long held that the Sabbath is the Seal of God in Revelation chapter 7, and they are the 144,000. Many also believe that the mark of the Beast is Sunday worship. Is this really the case? What does the Bible actually say?

Well, the first thing that must be adressed is whether the Sabbath us called the seal of God in the Bible at all. It's not. It is called a sign between God and His people. This has led to the following argument:

1. A seal is a sign of one's authority.

2. The Sabbath is a sign.

"But as for you, speak to the sons of Israel, saying, 'You shall surely observe My sabbaths; for this is a sign between Me and you throughout your generations, that you may know that I am the LORD who sanctifies you. 'Therefore you are to observe the sabbath, for it is holy to you. Everyone who profanes it shall surely be put to death; for whoever does any work on it, that person shall be cut off from among his people. " Exodus 31:13-14

3. Therefore, the Sabbath is God's seal in Revelation 7.

Sounds plausible at first glance. However, if one takes this line of reasoning and applies it consistently, you run into problems. You could also argue:

1. A seal is a sign of one's authority.

2. The rainbow is a sign.

God said, "This is the sign of the covenant which I am making between Me and you and every living creature that is with you, for all successive generations;
I set My bow in the cloud, and it shall be for a sign of a covenant between Me and the earth." Genesis 9:12-13

3. Therefore, the rainbow is God's seal in Revelation chapter 7.

And:

1. A seal is a sign of one's authority.

2. Circumcision is a sign between God and His people.

"And you shall be circumcised in the flesh of your foreskin, and it shall be the sign of the covenant between Me and you." Genesis 17:11

3. Therefore, circumcision is the seal of God is Revelation chapter 7 (I guess the women have no hope).

And:

1 A seal is a sign of one's authority.

2. Worshipping at Mount Sinai was a sign to God's people.

"And He said, "Certainly I will be with you, and this shall be the sign to you that it is I who have sent you: when you have brought the people out of Egypt, you shall worship God at this mountain." Exodus 3:12

3. Therefore, worshipping at Mount Sinai is God's seal in Revelation chapter 7.

And:

1. A seal is a sign of one's authority.

2. The Feast of Unleavened Bread was a sign to God's people.

"For seven days you shall eat unleavened bread, and on the seventh day there shall be a feast to the LORD.
"Unleavened bread shall be eaten throughout the seven days; and nothing leavened shall be seen among you, nor shall any leaven be seen among you in all your borders.
"You shall tell your son on that day, saying, 'It is because of what the LORD did for me when I came out of Egypt.'
"And it shall serve as a sign to you on your hand, and as a reminder on your forehead, that the law of the LORD may be in your mouth; for with a powerful hand the LORD brought you out of Egypt." Exodus 13:6-9

3. Therefore, the Feast of Unleavened Bread is the seal of God in Revelation chapter 7.

And:

1. A seal is a sign of one's authority.

2. First-born dedication is a sign.

"Therefore, I sacrifice to the LORD the males, the first offspring of every womb, but every firstborn of my sons I redeem.'
"So it shall serve as a sign on your hand and as phylacteries on your forehead, for with a powerful hand the LORD brought us out of Egypt." Exodus 13:15b-16

3. Therefore, firstborn dedication is the seal of God in Revelation chapters 7.

Anyway, I think it's pretty clear. To take the "seal" of Revelation and to apply it to a "sign" in the Old Testament cannot work. It is simply the result of trying to fit the Bible into bizarre eschatology.

Now, what about the Mark of the Beast? Is it Christian Sunday worsihp? Firstly, it's basically an oxymoron too say the mark of the "antichrist" is the "Christian" sunday worship. It's important to point out that Christians met on Sundays very early in Christian history to celebrate the Ressurection of Christ.

"Now concerning the collection for the saints, as I directed the churches of Galatia, so do you also.
On the first day of every week each one of you is to put aside and save, as he may prosper, so that no collections be made when I come." 1 Corinthians 16:1-2

" On the first day of the week, when we were gathered together to break bread, Paul began talking to them, intending to leave the next day, and he prolonged his message until midnight." Acts 20:7

This day was called " the Lord's day":
"I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and I heard behind me a loud voice like the sound of a trumpet," Revelation 1:10

So, now that we've established that there is a Christian tradition of meeting on Sundays, does the book of Revelation provide any evidence for a "Sunday mark of the beast"?

"And he causes all, the small and the great, and the rich and the poor, and the free men and the slaves, to be given a mark on their right hand or on their forehead,
and he provides that no one will be able to buy or to sell, except the one who has the mark, either the name of the beast or the number of his name.
Here is wisdom. Let him who has understanding calculate the number of the beast, for the number is that of a man; and his number is six hundred and sixty-six." Revelation 13:16-18

There is nothing about the Sabbath in this passage. It only talks about a literal mark on the forehead or hand that bears the number or the name of the beast. The one who does not have this mark cannot buy or sell (some have suggested a computer chip is involved, but that's all speculation).

Does Sunday bear the name or number of the antichrist? No. There really is no evidence in this passage to support these bizarre claims.

Now, who are the 144,000? The answer is pretty simple. The Bible identifies them for us:


"And I saw another angel ascending from the rising of the sun, having the seal of the living God; and he cried out with a loud voice to the four angels to whom it was granted to harm the earth and the sea,
saying, "Do not harm the earth or the sea or the trees until we have sealed the bond-servants of our God on their foreheads."
And I heard the number of those who were sealed, one hundred and forty-four thousand sealed from every tribe of the sons of Israel:
from the tribe of Judah, twelve thousand were sealed, from the tribe of Reuben twelve thousand, from the tribe of Gad twelve thousand,
from the tribe of Asher twelve thousand, from the tribe of Naphtali twelve thousand, from the tribe of Manasseh twelve thousand,
from the tribe of Simeon twelve thousand, from the tribe of Levi twelve thousand, from the tribe of Issachar twelve thousand,
from the tribe of Zebulun twelve thousand, from the tribe of Joseph twelve thousand, from the tribe of Benjamin, twelve thousand were sealed." Revelation 7:2-8

In the end, the sensational claims of Sundays being " SATAN'S SABBATH" and the Saturday Sabbath being the Seal of God don't line up with Scripture. No one would independently come up with these ideas by reading Scripture by itself.

God Bless

Wow, what a bunch of BS, sorry, that's all I got to say after reading that. Also, watch it, your seeming more and more like your on a crusade to prove us all wrong. If that's the case, your not welcomed here. This is for polite biblical conversation, not for attacks.

Do some research, SDA's believe that the people keeping God's True Sabbath are the 144,000. SDA's do not hold the belief that Seventh Day Adventism is the only denomination of truth. They believe that the 144,000 will be made of people from all denominations and religions who accepted Christ and decided to keep Saturday holy. Again, don't attack when you don't know things fully, it only shows ignorance.



Also, you argue about the seals, however, and I love this, all the verses you give for OTHER signs are BEFORE the sabbath. The sabbath as a sign is the last one given, so it still stays plusible that it is the seal of God. And there are also other later verses in other books saying the Sabbath is the sign of God. You forgot to mention that.

ANTI-Christ, means the oposite of everything Christ is. So, if God's Sabbath is Saturday, the oposite is SUNDAY.

First, Sunday was only celebrated as the LORD DAY after AD. 360, because of the Councel Of Laodicea. Why? Because Pagens were angry that Christians were not worshiping on Sunday, the day of the Sun God, so because of an anti-jewish feeling at the time, they changed the sabbath.

The bible makes it clear that the sabbath is reffered to as THE LORD'S DAY.

And saying that 300 years after Jesus died is early, really is a weak argument. For historical proof, do a google search or go to http://www.sabbathtruth.com

Interesting, those verses were because of Paul was traveling, it was a one time only thing.

And the one of John, he's reffering to THE LORD'S DAY as in the Saturday Sabbath. Jesus said he was LORD OF THE SABBATH. And that the sabbath is HIS day. Thus, THE LORDS DAY is the sabbath which Joh spoke of. Especially since history points to THE LORD'S DAY being saturday back then.

1 word, SYMBOLIC, SYMBOLIC, SYMBOLIC!

Ahem, I did and I know alot of people who came up with the idea from studying the scripture on their own. I'm really getting tired of arguing with you, your arguments are weak and you don't always take context into effect with the verses you post up.

Please, the next time you post, research fully what you post. lol

-Matt

<<<Wow, what a bunch of BS, sorry, that's all I got to say after reading that.>>>

Excuse me?

<<<This is for polite biblical conversation, not for attacks>>>

That's what I thought...

"and there must be no filthiness and silly talk, or coarse jesting, which are not fitting, but rather giving of thanks. " Ephesians 5:4

"So have I become your enemy by telling you the truth?" Galatians 4:16

<<<Do some research, SDA's believe that the people keeping God's True Sabbath are the 144,000. SDA's do not hold the belief that Seventh Day Adventism is the only denomination of truth. They believe that the 144,000 will be made of people from all denominations and religions who accepted Christ and decided to keep Saturday holy. Again, don't attack when you don't know things fully, it only shows ignorance.>>>

Perhaps it isn't the universral belief. But let's face it, SDA's are only major denomination that believes the Mosaic Law needs to be partially kept (i.e. the Sabbath). I didn't "attack." There was no insult, no cuss words. I merely debated.

<<<Also, you argue about the seals, however, and I love this, all the verses you give for OTHER signs are BEFORE the sabbath. The sabbath as a sign is the last one given, so it still stays plusible that it is the seal of God.>>>

What does it being the last one have to do with it? It's just as plausible as the rainbow.

<<<And there are also other later verses in other books saying the Sabbath is the sign of God. You forgot to mention that.>>>

I didn't forget, it simply isn't necessary. It's a sign between God and Israel. Not a seal.

<<<First, Sunday was only celebrated as the LORD DAY after AD. 360, because of the Councel Of Laodicea. Why? Because Pagens were angry that Christians were not worshiping on Sunday, the day of the Sun God, so because of an anti-jewish feeling at the time, they changed the sabbath.>>>

Christians met on Sundays far before A.D. 360 (Acts 20:7, 1 Corinthians 16:2). No anti-semitism, no pagan sun god.

<<<The bible makes it clear that the sabbath is reffered to as THE LORD'S DAY.>>>

Where is the Sabbath specifically called "the Lord's day"?

<<<Interesting, those verses were because of Paul was traveling, it was a one time only thing.>>>

Actually, it is mentioned twice, not once. 1 Corinthians 16:2 specifically says to meet on Sundays.

<<<And the one of John, he's reffering to THE LORD'S DAY as in the Saturday Sabbath.>>>

You can have that opinion, but the title "The Lord's Day" has always been applied to Sunday.

<<<And saying that 300 years after Jesus died is early, really is a weak argument.>>>

It would be, but I didn't say that.

<<<1 word, SYMBOLIC, SYMBOLIC, SYMBOLIC!>>>

What do the 12 tribes symbolize then? It's pretty clear. They are literally numbered according to tribes. There is absolutely nothing in Scripture to suggest these are not what the Bible says they are: the sons of Israel.

<<<Ahem, I did and I know alot of people who came up with the idea from studying the scripture on their own>>>

Without any influcence at all from a Seventh Day Adventist? :-)

<<<I'm really getting tired of arguing with you, your arguments are weak and you don't always take context into effect with the verses you post up. >>>

What I am getting tired of is accusations of me taking verses out of context, without giving specific examples and explaining how they are out of context. Please give examples. If you cannot give examples then it is merely ad hominem attacks to cover up the lack of scriptural support for your arguments. I've already been cussed at, I'd appreciate some reasoned debate.

God Bless

Nice, you tried to change subjects. But I won't let you. First, I never said about the sabbath. And SDA's hold the belief as the bible says that the sabbath and the mosaic law are sperate. But that's in another discussion already. I said you were wrong to claim SDA's believed something when they DIDN'T. It's wrong.

The problem is, the bible only says the Sabbath is a sign after the others. They don't repeat after than any other signs but the sabbath. And they continue to use the sabbath more times in the scriptures. So the sabbath IS reffered to and is more plausible as the SEAL of God.

Both those are one time only things, Paul is traveling. It does not at all say anything that God calls Sunday the LORD'S DAY or that it was a day of rest. Unless you have more specific verses, don't use them. You take those out of the context that they were written.

Wasn't it Jesus who said he was LORD OF THE SABBATH and that THE SABBATH WAS HIS DAY. So does that not mean that THE LORD'S DAY is the sabbath??????

So than I guess Revelation was literal when it said that MONSTERS would rise and angels would be seen flying overhead. Ofcoatse not, it's all symbolic!

Yes, is it that hard to believe?

When did someone cuss at you?

-Matt

<<<Nice, you tried to change subjects. But I won't let you. I said you were wrong to claim SDA's believed something when they DIDN'T. It's wrong.>>>

You believe the 144,000 are the people who keep the Saturday Sabbath as a requirement. Therefore, the 144,000 are obviously "Seventh Day" Adventists.

<<<And SDA's hold the belief as the bible says that the sabbath and the mosaic law are sperate.>>>

Where does the Bible say that?

<<<Both those are one time only things, Paul is traveling.>>>

Paul said to meet on Sunday. It wasn't a one day thing.

<<<Unless you have more specific verses, don't use them. You take those out of the context that they were written.>>>

How more specific can they be? 1 Corinthians 16:2 says to meet on Sundays, and Acts 20:7 has an actual example of meeting on Sundays.

<<<Wasn't it Jesus who said he was LORD OF THE SABBATH and that THE SABBATH WAS HIS DAY. So does that not mean that THE LORD'S DAY is the sabbath??????>>>

Yes, Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath, as He is the Lord of the rest of the Mosaic law, for He was the one who gave the Mosaic law. The Lord's day has always meant the day of Christ's ressurection, not to mention the time He appeared after the ressurection specifically on Sunday (John 20:26) and the descent of the Holy Spirit on Sunday (Acts 2:1). Apparently, the Lord kept meeting with believers on Sunday, shouldnt we?

<<<So than I guess Revelation was literal when it said that MONSTERS would rise and angels would be seen flying overhead. Ofcoatse not, it's all symbolic!>>>

Well, I don't think it's unreasonable for an angel to fly overhead. Jesus Himself 'flew' into the clouds. You believe that to be literal don't Also, they aren't 'MONSTERS', they are demons. Demons are very real. I never said the entire book of Revelation doesn't contain symbology. I'm just saying it is only symbolic when it is obvious that is what it is saying.

Again, I ask you, what in the text suggests that "the sons of Israel" aren't the sons of Israel? And, what do the 12 tribes represent?

<<<Yes, is it that hard to believe?>>>

Yes, very.

<<<When did someone cuss at you?>>>

Did you forget what you wrote already? "Wow, what a bunch of BS, sorry, that's all I got to say after reading that." Maybe you consider that to be edifying speech, but I, and I think the Lord would definitely consider that inappropiate.

God Bless.

No, there are other denominations besides SDA's that keep the Seventh Day Sabbath. So your statement is false. Also, do some research on what SDA's believe will happen to the churches at the end.

Do a bible search for sabbath and you'll see that is sometimes reffered to as the ROYAL LAW and other names, while the other laws are reffered to as MOSAIC.

Yes it was, considering the context that before this there was nothing about this and now that he's passing through on a mission trip he tells them this. It's a 1 time temporary thing. Sheesh.

Interesting that you mentioned that, lol. Because that actually supports my argument. Jesus rested on the Sabbath along with everyone else and waited till AFTER the sabbath rest to visit and talk. Because Sunday is a WORK DAY, so Jesus came to them for them to do HIS WORK. But the Sabbath he still rested on, because the Sabbath is still intact.

Wow, ONLY SYMBOLIC WHEN IT'S OBVIOUS????? Interesting, because for the longest time people thought the demons were LITERAL. So, to say you need judgement on your own to consider something is symbolic or not is pretty dangerous. Revelation is about the end of time and what leads up to it, so basicly you need to compare History and Revelaion together and see the comparisons.

Well, now you can believe it. Because it's so.

Wait, did you just say BS was a cuss?? Please, I'm just about.....here it comes.....LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BS means, to most people online, as meaning totally false and made up. It wasn't meant as an abbreviation, just in case you didn't realize that.

-Matt

<<<Do a bible search for sabbath and you'll see that is sometimes reffered to as the ROYAL LAW and other names, while the other laws are reffered to as MOSAIC.>>>

As far as I know, "royal law," is only mentioned once. It doesn't mention the sabbath. The word "Mosaic" isn't even in the Bible. I don't believe I'm the one who needs to do a Bible seach.

<<<Yes it was, considering the context that before this there was nothing about this and now that he's passing through on a mission trip he tells them this. It's a 1 time temporary thing. Sheesh.>>>

He said to meet every Sunday, there doesn't seem to be any idea of a temporal command.

<<<Interesting that you mentioned that, lol. Because that actually supports my argument. Because that actually supports my argument. Jesus rested on the Sabbath along with everyone else and waited till AFTER the sabbath rest to visit and talk.>>>

So, God meeting with His followers is breaking the Sabbath? Not likely.

<<<Wow, ONLY SYMBOLIC WHEN IT'S OBVIOUS????? Interesting, because for the longest time people thought the demons were LITERAL. So, to say you need judgement on your own to consider something is symbolic or not is pretty dangerous. Revelation is about the end of time and what leads up to it, so basicly you need to compare History and Revelaion together and see the comparisons.>>>

You are really dodging the issue. There is nothing to suggest that "the sons of Israel" is symbolic. As for the demons being literal, it's not at all unlikely.

<<<Wait, did you just say BS was a cuss?? Please, I'm just about.....here it comes.....LOL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

BS means, to most people online, as meaning totally false and made up. It wasn't meant as an abbreviation, just in case you didn't realize that.>>>

Well, I'm not in the online world too much (I like to get out occasionally). But, using my critical thinking skills, I don't think people picked two random letters that happen to be the same letters of an abbreviation for something else, and have the same basic meaning. In the real world, this would mean something inappropiate. It probably wouldn't be considered a 'cuss' by most, but I believe anything like that is. Just refrain from it, please. It's a side issue, I really don't care how you talk. Lets move on.

God Bless

Again, you avoid the context and what I have said and continue to push your beliefs. You aren't open to any idea's but your own.

No, but burdening their minds with the thoughts of what they had to do, yes, that would take away from bible rest.

And giving them pentacost on the sabbath would have meant taking away their rest by getting them to start going throughout the day preaching endlessly.

Wow, demon's is possibly literal??? Wow. No comment. Your own comment speaks for your weird bible theory's.

And since Revelation is mostly symbolic in regard to alot of things, than I'd say the "sons of Isreal" can deffinatly be SYMBOLIC!

-Matt